Why am I this pathetic.

[tracy_loo_who]

There is this fic I read the other day, and during my first read-through there were a couple of minor things that bothered me enough I had mixed reactions. But then I spent the next few days not being able to get this fic out of my head because mixed reactions aside, it is the most emotionally compelling Dean/Castiel fic I've ever read. (Apparently.) So I got over my issues (and now I can't remember why I was ever so hung up on them, but I've recently been kindly informed I'm "not in the norm" so I shall use that to excuse all aspects of my existence) and reread it today, and JFC I cannot even articulate how much I love this fic.

It takes Castiel as we know him today, separates him from Dean, gives him his own identity, and then reintroduces him to Dean. I don't know about you guys, but I think this is some pretty profound shit.

Sure, there's some canon evidence of Castiel's autonomy (he stood up to Dean in 5x02 like the BAMF he is and is, ostensibly, still searching for God on his own), but then we have things like Castiel waiting for Dean on the side of a road for four hours, Castiel always picking up his phone immediately and appearing at Dean's beck and call before Dean can finish telling him where he is, Castiel being called Dean's dog, Dean having to assure him that he "did great" in 5x10, etc. And Castiel's dependence on Dean is only exacerbated in fandom. Meanwhile, Dean is the well-meaning but emotionally stunted jerk he's always been.

Which makes for a pretty dysfunctional romantic relationship, right, even though it's epic and beautiful and I have complete faith it could survive the apocalypse. What I don't believe it can survive is the mundanity of everyday life after that, not without Castiel learning to give Dean some space (both literally and figuratively) and be his own person, and not without Dean accepting what he feels and learning to be more sensitive. Which is what I've wanted to see for a long fucking time and which is exactly what happens in this fic. Of course, the everyday life their relationship has to survive is not even close to mundane here, but I think the big difference is that unlike their apocalypse-era relationship, they now actually expect to survive and have to plan their future around themselves rather than around the rest of the world. (Also, they have a son, lolol the angelpreg warning was a huge DNW when I first saw it but I read the fic anyway and LOVED IT TO DEATH so whatever, exception to every rule and all that.) This fic makes post-apocalypse Dean/Castiel believable by dealing with their issues.

Plus, this new Castiel is everything I've ever wanted him to be. He's fiercely determined and protective, has a sense of humor, doesn't put up with any bullshit from anyone, understands and knows how to deal with his feelings, has self-confidence and self-respect, and still... is eternally fond of and exasperated by Dean. XD Seriously, he's come so far and matured so much, but that helpless love of Dean that we all adore him for is still very much a core part of who he is.

And now I am finally going to stop talking about this fic because quite frankly I'm already embarrassed by how pathetically I've obsessed and tl;dr'd about it and look, I STILL CAN'T STOP GUSHING, but I will now. Seriously.

JUST FUCKING READ IT ALREADY, PLS: This Story Was Brought To You By Our Sponsors by scaramouche

ETA: Hahha apparently this post has inspired further discussion. littlehollyleaf's counterargument to this post, and strangeandcharm on BAMF!Cas vs. vulnerable!Cas.

Comments

[ibroketuesday.livejournal.com]

Well, you aren't in the norm. *STICKS TONGUE OUT*

sjdfhdjfgsdhfgsdlkj I love this fic as helplessly as Castiel loves Dean. AND QUITE INCIDENTALLY I WOULD LIKE TO MARRY ITS CASTIEL.

[tracy.livejournal.com]

Sometimes I wonder why you like me.

IDK, dude, would you die for this fic? XD But fjkdlsjfskf ITS CASTIEL HAS ALREADY GOTTEN BACK TOGETHER WITH THE LOVE OF HIS LIFE WHO ISN'T YOU, SORRY.

[kalikahuntress.livejournal.com]

Maybe show can work on making that happen in season six, if they have any common sense. But for this to happen on the show, Misha will have to a lot of scenes away from the J2's which depending on whether the creators have any balls, would be awesome.

I will have to read this fic now.

[ibroketuesday.livejournal.com]

YES, THEY SHOULD MAKE ANGELPREG CANON IN S6. THIS IS MY DEAREST WISH!!

[tracy.livejournal.com]

Well, Misha did say part of the reason they brought him on as a regular was to take some of the pressure off J2, though it hadn't happened yet because most of Castiel's scenes WERE with J2. If they still want to give J2 a bit of a break, this would be an amazing way to do it.

YOU WILL LOVE IT. :D

[silverusagi]

Aw, I was getting all excited, only to realize about halfway through this post that I'd already read the fic, LOL!

[tracy.livejournal.com]

It is more than worth a reread or ten. And this coming from someone who almost never rereads fics!

[tracy.livejournal.com]

On the other hand, sometimes all fandom does is harp on about how completely devoted Castiel is to Dean and how he'd do anything for him.

LOL I think the "what is this penis and why is it erect?" fics were really common back when this fandom first started out, but I haven't read any fics like that in a long time. Or maybe it's just that I've become more selective in what I read now that there's so much more stuff TO read?

Well, they'll never be fucking on the show, nor do I think they'll ever have him be harbor "inappropriate" feelings for Dean on the show. I think his submissiveness is simply due to being so lost and so alone that he'll do anything Dean says if it means he can keep Dean's friendship.

[tracy.livejournal.com]

Oh wow, this sounds like an amazing fic, and hits two of my biggest buttons -- mpreg AND bestiality. *_* Plus, all the ~drama~ sounds delicious. I would love a link!

[jiggawha.livejournal.com]

NEEDS MOAR *see icon*

[ibroketuesday.livejournal.com]

sdhfsjfd oh my god you whore I love you

[tracy.livejournal.com]

RIGHT? It's like watching my own baby grow up, SO PROUD OF HIM. ♥

[pansylove.livejournal.com]

Well with a review like that! *goes off to read*

[tracy.livejournal.com]

You will not be disappointed!

[tracy.livejournal.com]

Is there a particular reason you haven't finished it?

[oatmeal-queen.livejournal.com]

dude, thanks for the rec. that's actually just the kind of story i've been hunting around for. which is saying something cause i haven't had much interest in reading new material lately :\ its nice to see such a refreshing take, not just on Castiel in general, but in a post-apocalypse where life continues on in a not so hunky-dory way.

Castiel looks pleased, but the smile is not meant for Dean. “I could never say no to you before. I wasn’t sure I would ever be able to.” Then he leans forward and presses a finger to Dean’s nose. “No.”

I think i can honestly say that was my favorite part. because i kept expecting him to cave, throughout the entire thing i was waiting for what i was used to and Cas giving in to Dean's whim, but it didn't happen. i even handled the ewgrossmpregwtfnotreadingit love child part really well and kinda like Daniel X)

you always find the best stuff. no wonder i keep you on speed dial.

[tracy.livejournal.com]

RIGHT? Everything about this fic is so different and REFRESHING, and in a way I can get behind so so hard.

I don't know if I can say that was my favorite part, but it's definitely the proudest moment I experienced while reading the fic. SO MUCH YES to Castiel not giving in to Dean, even at the very end, omgggg so much yes. UNSPEAKABLE AMOUNT OF LOVE FOR THAT. And I have a very strong aversion to any form of mpreg myself but at least Castiel wasn't walking around with a bulging belly and there wasn't any of that sappy curtain shit so I enjoyed it.

Heee, I feel complimented indeed and it wasn't even my fic! XD

[elvisglasses5.livejournal.com]

Wow!!! That's quite a rec. Can't wait to read it!

I had a similar, fangirl-y reaction to Oselle's "All Saints" trilogy. Completely out of nowhere, total fanfic obsession. Glad to know it can happen to even my favorite authors. *cough*YOU*cough* : )

[ibroketuesday.livejournal.com]

YES! That trilogy is one of the ones that stayed with me the way this fic has.

[22by7.livejournal.com]

this is the fic that i badly wanted to eat fandom, because it had the Castiel I SO WANTED TO SEE IN FIC

CASTIEL BEING HIS OWN PERSON

CASTIEL SAYING NO TO DEAN

CASTIEL LOVING DEAN BUT NOT GIVING INTO THE UNHEALTHY SHIT THAT SO MANY PEOPLE THINK IS HIS UNAVOIDABLE FATE OR W/E

loved the fuck out of it, glad you're reccing it so everyone ever reads and loves it. yess.

[tracy.livejournal.com]

I ALSO WANT THIS FIC TO EAT FANDOM. AND THEN THE WRITERS, SO WE CAN HAVE THIS CAS ON THE SHOW GODDAMMIT.

SERIOUSLY I AM STILL AMAZED THAT SHE TOOK DEAN AND CASTIEL IN ALL THEIR FUCKED UP GLORY AND GAVE THEM A COMPLETELY PLAUSIBLE START TO A HEALTHY RELATIONSHIP, WHAT EVEN IS THIS. BOGGLED AND DAZZLED.

THIS FIC IS COMPLETELY SHIP-REAFFIRMING.

[rock-chick-333.livejournal.com]

Heh, if you were to head over to my journal you'd find a post there from last week where I squee'd over this exact fic, as in OMG I READ MPREG AND I LIKED IT WTF!!!! Awesome, yes.

[tracy.livejournal.com]

HAHHA MY REACTION AS WELL. I feel like my personal values are being overthrown or something. XD

[a-carnal-mink.livejournal.com]

Hrm. I suppose I must be the exception that proves everybody else's rule or something, but this just... *sigh* really doesn't work for me. And now I feel bad because everyone else clearly thinks it's the best thing since sliced bread and I'm just not seeing it. :-/

I feel rather like I did when Snarry fandom was all a'flutter over Home Fries Nazi I was blinking at my screen going "Bzuh?".

[strangeandcharm.livejournal.com]

*whispers* I didn't like it either. I tried, I really did, but... no. I can't see what all the fuss is about!

Tracy's gonna love us.

[lady-jane.livejournal.com]

And Castiel's dependence on Dean is only exacerbated in fandom. Meanwhile, Dean is the well-meaning but emotionally stunted jerk he's always been.

Which makes for a pretty dysfunctional romantic relationship, right, even though it's epic and beautiful and I have complete faith it could survive the apocalypse

OMG, that made me laugh so hard.

I'm kinda out of the direct light of fandom, so I'm sure you've had this conversation other times, but do you think the appeal of that helplessness for fandom is the fact that Cas supports Dean unquestioningly? Cas/Dean seems to provide a dynamic opposing the friction that motivates Sam's continual resistance to falling in line behind Dean as leader. I've been thinking that maybe if the show introduced a female love interest/sex partner for Dean who actually was tough and supported his vocation and the character that drives him to it, that maybe the fandom wouldn't be so damn anti-female? ...yeah, I probably just want to believe that's possible.

But anyway, thanks for the rec! I reread it, and enjoyed it immensely a second time. I really liked this one for the same reason you did - Cas was all badass with motivations of his own, not just as Dean's "dog." Personally, I take Famine's remarks with a grain of salt; it echoes Heaven's too closely. Both Heaven and Hell are invested in convincing Dean that God had NOT "left free the will" - so denigrating Cas and driving a wedge in the team is in H&H's best interests.

Thanks for the rec!

[tracy.livejournal.com]

do you think the appeal of that helplessness for fandom is the fact that Cas supports Dean unquestioningly?

Yes! Dean has always shown the same sort of tragically unconditional love for Sam (up until the demon blood happened, I guess) without getting that in return. So in the beginning (for me, anyway, and a lot of other Dean!girls), it was about Castiel giving Dean that. But then at some point my love for Castiel surpassed my love for Dean, so while it's still about giving Dean unconditional love, it's also just about how freaking endearing that is, that Castiel can be all Dean's in that sweet, eternally hearts-in-eyes sort of way.

Oh, hmm, you make a good point about Famine echoing Heaven. I have no idea what the origins of the Four Horsemen are, but it would be cool if they were connected to Heaven somehow. And I agree that any wedge they can drive between Team Free Will would be good in their minds.

I'm stupidly pleased you enjoyed the fic and I didn't even write it. XD

[littlehollyleaf.livejournal.com]

Hello! Um... so your comments here got me thinking, and those thoughts turned into a counter argument of sorts (http://littlehollyleaf.livejournal.com/307921.html) in which I mention you quite a bit. I'm very sorry! I don't want to misrepresent you or anything, so if you want to check my LJ post go right ahead and let me know about any comments/quotes you disapprove of and I will alter them ASAP.

Also, my post is a bit of a wip really, so opinions therein are open to change anyway and not to be taken too seriously. I just wanted to let you know I was talking about you so I don't end up coming across as this freaky person who discusses people they don't even know behind their back... if the 'freak' part stays I'll still call this a success :p

[tracy.livejournal.com]

Hahhaha I will read it in a bit and I'm sure I'll have ~thoughts~ since it's Castiel and when do I ever not have ~thoughts~ about him (*sigh*), but whatever you said, no need to apologize! As long as it wasn't "Tracy thinks Castiel should DIAF." XD

[ibroketuesday.livejournal.com]

LOL BY THE WAY I LOVE THAT ONLY FIFTEEN PEOPLE (I COUNTED) COMMENTED TO THE ENTRY ITSELF, BUT THERE ARE 230 COMMENTS WTF.

[tracy.livejournal.com]

IT'S MOSTLY YOUR FAULT. ALSO, READ THIS: http://littlehollyleaf.livejournal.com/307921.html

[darksilvercat.livejournal.com]

Argh, I read this post earlier and I was all 'I liked the fic but it didn't work for me on several levels!' and then I couldn't figure out why and I was all deliberating and thinking it over and ARRRRRGH. BUT NOW I HAVE ORDERED MY THOUGHTS. And by ordered I mean largely copypasted and expanded on my comments on strangeandcharm's post (http://strangeandcharm.livejournal.com/110938.html?thread=3480922#t3480922), but whatever, IT'S YOUR TURN FOR THE TEAL DEER:

The thing is, on the show, Castiel is actually a pretty balanced character right now. He still retains much of his BAMF qualities - from killing angels in 5.01 and standing up to Dean in 5.02, to facing down Lucifer and roasting Meg in 5.10, facing off against Anna in 5.13 and catching himself a cupid in 5.14 - even when he's not actively kicking ass he's still confident and in control. But he's also starting to show some vulnerabilities and he's not just a Terminator any more, so there's a balance there.

And as for his relationship with Dean: I love that Dean is such a significant figure in Castiel’s world, because it's not just Dean. He still holds to his faith in his Father, Sam is his friend, he had started to bond with Ellen and Jo, and we could probably count Bobby and Chuck as his friends also. He's pursuing his own mission in his search for God, he's fighting his own battles, and Dean may be the catalyst for that, but he is not Castiel's sole reason for being, which I think is one of the biggest things we shippers tend to forget. And yes, Castiel has dropped his searching to assist the Winchesters on crucial matters, but Dean has done the same for him. It’s easy to miss the forest for the trees in this case - sure Castiel’s actions have obedience written all over them on one level, but in context, they’re fighting an apocalypse, and when Dean calls, it’s usually kinda important. Helping Dean with the immediate issues > searching for a long-term solution. (As for the waiting at the side of the road in 5.04 - he had nowhere else to go. Which is obviously sucky, but again, fighting an apocalypse kinda makes it difficult for rebel angels to go house-hunting. So it’s not necessarily the dog waiting at its master’s doorstep that we tend to take it as.)

And on top of all that, we actually have no way of knowing what Castiel has been up to while he’s not with the Winchesters. “Well I hear differently” - hear from who? Where does he go, who else has he spoken to on his search for God? It’s entirely possible that he’s met and formed connections with other people already. (And I’ve still not given up on the hope that there may be other angels who agree with him and are helping him.)

Having said all that, Castiel is not human, and that's one of the things that attracted me to this ship in the first place. Dean has been through a lot and he's lost a lot, he deserves something that is capable of loving him fiercely and absolutely. I don't see Castiel as being 'less' because of his loyalty to either God or Dean, and I don't mind the concept of him doing as they wish because in my mind, loyalty to God/Dean does not automatically equal disloyalty to his own needs/desires. I don't see it as him being unable to say 'no' either - he can and has refused Dean in the past when he believes his course of action is more appropriate (see 5.02, 5.06 and his meeting with Anna in 5.13) and he can also make requests for himself.

I'm not saying he's completely his own man, but he's certainly far more independent and self-confident than many fics make him out to be. And while Dean is the reason for much of what he now is, he’s not the centre of Castiel’s entire universe.

[darksilvercat.livejournal.com]

In fandom, unfortunately, we seem to be burrowing deeper and deeper into our own favourite tropes. Woobie!Cas is becoming increasingly pathetic, BAMF!Cas tends not to show any vulnerability at all, and Castiel/Dean is becoming all-consuming to the point where neither can function without the other. Which is all fine, they're all tropes that people love and enjoy, but I do wish there was more fic out there that covers all those aspects of canon!Castiel rather than focusing on and exaggerating just one. He can be devoted to Dean as he is now and still have the ability to think and decide for himself. He can fight or ninja his way out of crappy situations. He can show vulnerability without immediately breaking into a woobie mess. You just have to find the right balance!

SO. The reason the fic didn't work for me is because it felt like a fix-it, not for issues in the show itself, but for fanfic tropes that have become overly prevalent. What was 'fixed' was, to my mind, OOC in the first place. And to me it seemed as though Castiel didn't actually overcome his problems with devoting himself to others at cost to himself - he simply extended that devotion from Dean to include his son, and possibly Claire. He'd still risk his life for the three of them, he'll still love them and devote himself to them, it's just that he'd learned to say 'no' and be more independent, be his own person, which I can already see happening in canon, and so the whole thing just felt obsolete. The character he was at the end was wonderful, and although still flawed to me, he was certainly close to what I envision Castiel becoming as time goes by. But this particular version of that fully developed Castiel was transformed from something that was - to me - OOC to begin with. And so the whole thing just felt off.

And now for my thoughts on yaoi what I would like to see for this pairing:

It is very true that Castiel and Dean as they are now would not have a fully healthy and functioning relationship, but it's Dean that needs the major workover. Castiel still has some growing of his own to do, but he's well on his way compared to where he was just 18 months ago, and he’s capable of becoming that independent being without a drastic 5 year separation from all the people who have supported him through these crucial early stages, IMO.

I know we like to speculate on Castiel falling hard and fast for Dean and being unable to control it - and that's where the blind devotion trope began - but the thing is, he hasn't. It took him a year to even fully realise that he believed in Dean over Heaven, and throughout S5 he's already started letting other people into his life alongside Dean. I have always said that I could easily see Castiel canonically falling in love with Dean, but if anything he would be as uncertain and wary of his feelings as Dean himself would be. And in all honesty, just as Sam will always be of great importance to Dean and keeps him grounded, I think Castiel's faith would keep him from ever fully devoting himself to Dean. We tend to treat the entire concept of Dean replacing Heaven as meaning that Dean has become the entirety of Castiel's universe, but I think we seriously underplay the importance of his unwavering faith in his Father.

So I’d like to see more of that acknowledgement that it took time for Castiel to reach the point he’s now at with Dean. It started with respect and developed into trust, became empathy, which developed into doubt and feeling. He didn’t make the decision to disobey until 4.20, and even then it wasn’t just for Dean. I don’t for a second believe that Castiel acts only for Dean, I believe he wanted to stop Lucifer from rising and had no-one else to trust. It was Dean who finally brought him back round, and certainly in S5 he’s acting as much for Dean’s friendship as for the world, but I also think he’s doing what he thinks is right, what his Father would want. None of that need detract from the fact that Dean was the catalyst, Dean was the unique and impossible human that caused Castiel to question and doubt and feel, and the more he gets used to feeling, the more he could feel for Dean.